.

” Peres was was measured and fair in his analysis ”

He said “There is in England a saying that an anti-Semite is someone who hates the Jews more than is necessary.”

You are suggesting that he did not say “the English are anti Semitic” and you are right…but the implication head butts one.

Teddy Bear

“those that are not anti-Semitic would understand where Peres was coming from, and why he made the remarks he did. ”

That is straight out of Joan of arc when she asks what crime she has committed and is told she should know.

Fully agree that Israel needs to be strong. I’m a great believer in ‘disproportionate’, ie. leave no room for doubt.

What I said about direct negotiations is indeed optimistic. There is massive asymmetry between the two sides in so many respects – culture, values, democracy, rule of law, education, economic and technological development, military strength … you name it.

And it’s particularly difficult when the other side has a massive propensity to self-delusion, for example a readiness to swallow daft conspiracy theories, which is something common right across the Muslim world (eg. 9/11 committed by the US administration or by the Mossad). When I was briefly learning Arabic in London, the teacher was a History graduate from the University of Cairo in his thirties. He told us that Israel won its 1948 War of Independence because the Russians had sold Egypt consignments of rifles that fired backwards.

Either that or the troops were taught to hold them the wrong way round. We’ll never know.

I am the other Joshua.

I agree that face to face talks and dealing with the issues at hand can resolve the problem. In fact there have always been solutions to the problem throughout from the end of the 19th cetury until now. But negotiations usually to succeed must come from a position of strength. A compromise means that one gives more in negotiations than what one might plan to , whilst the other has to accept less than it wants. The present climate is that Israel’s position on the map is being undermined continuously, religiously, politically and legally,and that it is not being recognised, that makes this conflict so difficult. The question is really why is this happening and what can Israel do to reverse the situation.

I have read Melanie Phillips column in the JC about 2 weeks ago on Robert Aumann’s “Game Theory” (a Nobel Prize laureate in economics) He maintains that if you want peace NOW one must prepare for war first i.e. to be prepared. Game Theory as I understand it, and how it presents itself, is a game of paradoxes.

http://www.aish.com/jw/me/97755479.html

and on You tube

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rJAFRF75OVA

as to the jews who are afraid to step on the masters’ toes, GIRD UP YOU LOINS LIKE MEN!!!! TELL IT LIKE IT IS. they already hate you any anyhow. at least they will have some respect.YES. GREAT BRITAIN IS ANTISEMITIC. IT HAS ALWAYS BEEN. THAT IS THE TRUTH.

In response to Joshua and Another Joshua and any other Joshua who happens to stop by …

This was not intended as a throwaway line. I genuinely think the two publications and their respective websites are of poor quality, so the question is do they matter ?

On one hand yes, the two articles will reinforce negative opinions about Israel amongst a large number of British people and given what Peres was actually saying, this is unfair, as the articles took sentences out of context and misrepresented him.

On the other hand no, because the distorted drivel that appears in the British media is symptomatic of an increasingly dumbed-down society. Britain has some lovely thatched cottages, charming country pubs and beautiful stately homes, but the rest of it ? For sheer grimness and shabbiness, you have to go to Eastern Europe to find anything that matches large areas of Britain’s inner cities and (former) industrial towns.

Look at our car industry. Look at manufacturing in general. Look at the clueless England football team. The ‘greatness’ of Great Britain is waning fast.

Will the UK play any sort of role in the eventual resolution of the Israel-Palestinian conflict ? If it does it will be fairly minor. The Israelis will certainly look to keep the UK at arm’s length, as it will not be perceived as a helpful or neutral contributor.

The Israelis and the Palestinians really need to sit down alone and hammer out a solution. They know the area and they know the history, even though the official narratives are presently wide apart. The Israelis have done stupid things, like building settlements in provocative locations and isolated corners of the West Bank, and the Palestinians have committed countless violent and ultimately self-destructive acts. But so long as both sides can resolve the issue of the Temple Mount and surrounding areas in Jerusalem, all other West Bank issues are eminently solvable. And once agreement is reached, the Hamas regime in Gaza will wither on the vine.

At present the problem is a lack of strong, effective leadership on both sides. Someone needs to create a new narrative which admits that both Jews and Palestinians have been victims of history in different ways and neither side is going anywhere, so let’s just find the best solution for both peoples. And it means selling compromise to the respective constituencies.

Anyway, I don’t think Britain has much to contribute to the process, which is why I don’t overly worry about the Daily Mail or Daily Express. For most followers of Robin’s site, this stuff is pretty unpleasant, but there’s not much we can do about it without circumstances changing in the Middle East itself.

ps. As Robin’s book elucidates, there is a civilisational malaise affecting all of Western Europe and not just Britain. But Britain’s newspapers are unique, in that many seem to be aimed at people with IQs of around 50. Maybe with good cause.