Comments on: Review of my new book, A State Beyond the Pale: Europe’s Problem with Israel http://www.robinshepherdonline.com/review-of-my-new-book-a-state-beyond-the-pale-europes-problem-with-israel/ Think Tank Blog: The online repository of articles on anti-Zionism and civilisational decline by analyst Robin Shepherd Thu, 29 Jul 2010 22:56:28 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.6.2 By: Jacqueline Rokotnitz http://www.robinshepherdonline.com/review-of-my-new-book-a-state-beyond-the-pale-europes-problem-with-israel/#comment-4130 Jacqueline Rokotnitz Mon, 21 Jun 2010 12:50:46 +0000 http://www.robinshepherdonline.com/?p=1490#comment-4130 Dr. Shepherd, your book is what I've been waiting for! Your opening chapters put EXACTLY (only far better) my explanation to anyone with ears in his/her head regarding the start of this interminable conflict. "Who started it" sounds like some kindergarten plea, but it is genuinely a vital point. The continual escalation of this seemingly insurmountable dead end situation is mind blowing. And as anyone could see during the recent "Flotilla-gate", the international media could wait to portray those lovely Turkish (and who knows what else) extremists provoking the Israelis off the shores of Gaza as innocuous peace-niks, and the wicked Israeli commandos were looking for anyone to assassinate as they do every day. Honestly, one could weep. I am from well left of centre in Israel, I never supported the settlement movement - as Ben Gurion said "Give the territories back..we have enough Arabs", and I'm pretty disgusted by the religious fanatics who sit in the middle of Hebron and aggravate the Arabs there, and who cut down their olive trees out of spite - shameful. But none of this would have come about if, as you so fairly point out, 100 million Arabs would have accepted a tiny corner of the Middle East as a refuge for what was at the time less than one million Jews (and even now is only six and a half million)...I will recommend your book everywhere and thank you. Dr. Shepherd, your book is what I’ve been waiting for! Your opening chapters put EXACTLY (only far better) my explanation to anyone with ears in his/her head regarding the start of this interminable conflict. “Who started it” sounds like some kindergarten plea, but it is genuinely a vital point. The continual escalation of this seemingly insurmountable dead end situation is mind blowing. And as anyone could see during the recent “Flotilla-gate”, the international media could wait to portray those lovely Turkish (and who knows what else) extremists provoking the Israelis off the shores of Gaza as innocuous peace-niks, and the wicked Israeli commandos were looking for anyone to assassinate as they do every day. Honestly, one could weep. I am from well left of centre in Israel, I never supported the settlement movement - as Ben Gurion said “Give the territories back..we have enough Arabs”, and I’m pretty disgusted by the religious fanatics who sit in the middle of Hebron and aggravate the Arabs there, and who cut down their olive trees out of spite - shameful. But none of this would have come about if, as you so fairly point out, 100 million Arabs would have accepted a tiny corner of the Middle East as a refuge for what was at the time less than one million Jews (and even now is only six and a half million)…I will recommend your book everywhere and thank you.

]]> By: gary ashton http://www.robinshepherdonline.com/review-of-my-new-book-a-state-beyond-the-pale-europes-problem-with-israel/#comment-3674 gary ashton Wed, 02 Jun 2010 02:32:44 +0000 http://www.robinshepherdonline.com/?p=1490#comment-3674 robin i read this book and finally finished after one sitting, so refreshing to read something that at least has credibility. you are really to be commended as it a rare and brave soul that would actually write such a piece given the level of hostility towards israel. it's a brilliant book, absolutely explosive in it's well thought out factual case. please promote it worldwide, get on tv, radio and print media as this stuff should be out there. however i fear the irrational hate fuelled frenzy is unstoppable by any common sense. robin
i read this book and finally finished after one sitting, so refreshing to read something that at least has credibility. you are really to be commended as it a rare and brave soul that would actually write such a piece given the level of hostility towards israel.
it’s a brilliant book, absolutely explosive in it’s well thought out factual case. please promote it worldwide, get on tv, radio and print media as this stuff should be out there. however i fear the irrational hate fuelled frenzy is unstoppable by any common sense.

]]> By: iva http://www.robinshepherdonline.com/review-of-my-new-book-a-state-beyond-the-pale-europes-problem-with-israel/#comment-3358 iva Sat, 08 May 2010 09:34:27 +0000 http://www.robinshepherdonline.com/?p=1490#comment-3358 Robin I have just came back from Israel where I have purchased your book,actually I got the last copy as the Steimatzky branch where I bought it run out of the copys!!! . Will start to read as soon as I can Robin I have just came back from Israel where I have purchased your book,actually I got the last copy as the Steimatzky branch where I bought it run out of the copys!!! . Will start to read as soon as I can

]]> By: wendy http://www.robinshepherdonline.com/review-of-my-new-book-a-state-beyond-the-pale-europes-problem-with-israel/#comment-3007 wendy Mon, 12 Apr 2010 15:10:49 +0000 http://www.robinshepherdonline.com/?p=1490#comment-3007 Now on page 98 of the book : terrific; well-written and cogent. All members of our so-called intelligentsia should be required to read and inwardly digest. I shall be passing it on to a good friend- who used to work for the diplomatic service-and who shares my concern about the absorption of hysterical and unbalanced 'Israel-bashing' into mainstream public discourse in the UK. We both believe that there has been a substantial,and insidiou,-shift of covert prejudice in the UK and that the targets are now the Jewish community and white 'chavs'.Open season as far as these groups are now concerned The examination of the decontextualisation of so much of the condemnation is particularly telling : my worry is that many younger people will grow up in ignorance of the true facts and hence come to believe all the poisonous nonsense that is peddled by influential commentators who should know better. I've been to Israel 3 times and my support for this tiny beleaguered country has never wavered. As regards Serbia, a visit to the country in 1995 convinced me that a similar, but less vitriolic, bias existed within the western media and aid agencies. Now on page 98 of the book : terrific; well-written and cogent.
All members of our so-called intelligentsia should be required to read and inwardly digest.

I shall be passing it on to a good friend- who used to work for the diplomatic service-and who shares my concern about the absorption of hysterical and unbalanced ‘Israel-bashing’ into mainstream public discourse in the UK.
We both believe that there has been a substantial,and insidiou,-shift of covert prejudice in the UK and that the targets are now the Jewish community and white ‘chavs’.Open season as far as these groups are now concerned

The examination of the decontextualisation of so much of the condemnation is particularly telling : my worry is that many younger people will grow up in ignorance of the true facts and hence come to believe all the poisonous nonsense that is peddled by influential commentators who should know better.

I’ve been to Israel 3 times and my support for this tiny beleaguered country has never wavered.

As regards Serbia, a visit to the country in 1995 convinced me that a similar, but less vitriolic, bias existed within the western media and aid agencies.

]]> By: Stephan Pereire http://www.robinshepherdonline.com/review-of-my-new-book-a-state-beyond-the-pale-europes-problem-with-israel/#comment-2407 Stephan Pereire Fri, 19 Mar 2010 16:34:22 +0000 http://www.robinshepherdonline.com/?p=1490#comment-2407 In ' A State beyond the Pale', you enunciate eight points (pages 10 - 34, in which you cite that the settlement issue is problematic, but not insurmountable are and highlight several... As you also mention, Partition of Palestine (which refered in 1947-48, to only thes land west of the Jordan River, as the Brits had already partitioned Palestine and transfered TransJordan (Palesininan land east of the Jordan River to a foreign ruler) was based on the Jews being a majority within the boundaries of the territory allocated by the United Nations for the Jewish State, and the Jews being a minority in the territories allocated for the Arab state. Jews had actually settled in both territories prior to partition (and excluding the laws implemented forbidding Jews from purchasing land in Arab designated territories, on both sides of the Jordan River - TransJordan, mimicking restrictions put into law by the House of Saud to the south, implemented laws forbidding Jews from residing within the Hashemite kingdom) Other than recognizing these regime as Apartheid, how can we accept these laws that forbid Jews from residing in territories that are not a part of the Jewish State? When, and if, an independant Palestinian State is declared, and recognized by the members of the United Nations, that state will adopt its own judicial system, and residents within that nation's borders will become subject to these laws. When the Palestinian legal system is implemented, they will have to address three groups of settlers. 1. Those settlers who have legally acquired (or reacquired) lands on which they reside within the Palestinian territory, should be able to remain, as long as they have legal documentation of their ownership, and agree to reside in the territory, and observe the laws of the Palestinian state. 2. Those settlers who have settled on lands which were deemed property of the Ottoman government (it is by these laws that Israel has determined what lands are declared State Lands), should be able to remain, but within the parameters set by the Palestinian government (formal leases would need to be drawn, indicating the terms of residence and leasehold). Again, residence would be allowed as long as these settlers agree to observe the laws of the state. 2. Those settlers who have illegally taken lands from Palestinian residents should be prosecuted for their actions, fined for damages, the land returned to their rightful owners, and the guilty individuals deported from the Palestinian state, or if they wish to be able to remain, incarcerated for the appropriate term. If the Palestinian State is amenable to keeping these settlers, and allow them to reside in their claimed residences, then, under the new Palestinain legal system, they may choose to work out individual agreements, and levy compensation. So, given the legal authority that will be derived from the establishment of a Palestinian state, the barrier to peace presented by the settlements, as claimed by the PA, is in fact, a non-issue. The key to this resolution, is the trust built between all parties that a legal solution can and will be implemented, and, as we see from the oft halted talks, there is ample distrust on all sides. In ‘ A State beyond the Pale’, you enunciate eight points (pages 10 - 34, in which you cite that the settlement issue is problematic, but not insurmountable are and highlight several…

As you also mention, Partition of Palestine (which refered in 1947-48, to only thes land west of the Jordan River, as the Brits had already partitioned Palestine and transfered TransJordan (Palesininan land east of the Jordan River to a foreign ruler) was based on the Jews being a majority within the boundaries of the territory allocated by the United Nations for the Jewish State, and the Jews being a minority in the territories allocated for the Arab state.

Jews had actually settled in both territories prior to partition (and excluding the laws implemented forbidding Jews from purchasing land in Arab designated territories, on both sides of the Jordan River - TransJordan, mimicking restrictions put into law by the House of Saud to the south, implemented laws forbidding Jews from residing within the Hashemite kingdom) Other than recognizing these regime as Apartheid, how can we accept these laws that forbid Jews from residing in territories that are not a part of the Jewish State?

When, and if, an independant Palestinian State is declared, and recognized by the members of the United Nations, that state will adopt its own judicial system, and residents within that nation’s borders will become subject to these laws.

When the Palestinian legal system is implemented, they will have to address three groups of settlers.

1. Those settlers who have legally acquired (or reacquired) lands on which they reside within the Palestinian territory, should be able to remain, as long as they have legal documentation of their ownership, and agree to reside in the territory, and observe the laws of the Palestinian state.

2. Those settlers who have settled on lands which were deemed property of the Ottoman government (it is by these laws that Israel has determined what lands are declared State Lands), should be able to remain, but within the parameters set by the Palestinian government (formal leases would need to be drawn, indicating the terms of residence and leasehold). Again, residence would be allowed as long as these settlers agree to observe the laws of the state.

2. Those settlers who have illegally taken lands from Palestinian residents should be prosecuted for their actions, fined for damages, the land returned to their rightful owners, and the guilty individuals deported from the Palestinian state, or if they wish to be able to remain, incarcerated for the appropriate term. If the Palestinian State is amenable to keeping these settlers, and allow them to reside in their claimed residences, then, under the new Palestinain legal system, they may choose to work out individual agreements, and levy compensation.

So, given the legal authority that will be derived from the establishment of a Palestinian state, the barrier to peace presented by the settlements, as claimed by the PA, is in fact, a non-issue.

The key to this resolution, is the trust built between all parties that a legal solution can and will be implemented, and, as we see from the oft halted talks, there is ample distrust on all sides.

]]> By: cityca http://www.robinshepherdonline.com/review-of-my-new-book-a-state-beyond-the-pale-europes-problem-with-israel/#comment-2335 cityca Mon, 15 Mar 2010 22:49:32 +0000 http://www.robinshepherdonline.com/?p=1490#comment-2335 joseph gilfillan "...knowing there was something wrong with this picture..." Thanks for that brilliant phrase. Absolutely spot on. I remember watching the BBC coverage of the Balkan crises some years ago and thinking to myself, I can't trust any of this coverage - I don't know if the Serbs are getting the 'Israel treatment' or if in fact, they were as bad as they were portrayed. And all because the BBC and the MSM in general have forfeited their credibility, through their highly partial reporting. I'm currently reading Robin's book and have to agree with every word written here. joseph gilfillan
“…knowing there was something wrong with this picture…”

Thanks for that brilliant phrase. Absolutely spot on.

I remember watching the BBC coverage of the Balkan crises some years ago and thinking to myself, I can’t trust any of this coverage - I don’t know if the Serbs are getting the ‘Israel treatment’ or if in fact, they were as bad as they were portrayed. And all because the BBC and the MSM in general have forfeited their credibility, through their highly partial reporting.

I’m currently reading Robin’s book and have to agree with every word written here.

]]> By: joseph gilfillan http://www.robinshepherdonline.com/review-of-my-new-book-a-state-beyond-the-pale-europes-problem-with-israel/#comment-2321 joseph gilfillan Mon, 15 Mar 2010 08:42:06 +0000 http://www.robinshepherdonline.com/?p=1490#comment-2321 Robin, you ruined my girlfriends plans for the weekend. bought the book at 4 on saturday and finished 7 on sunday. just another witless brit poisoned by the lies in our media and establishment, i have for years sat quietly, passively and cowardly consuming the fictions, exaggerations and outright lies designed to undermine Israel and by extension the jews - knowing there was 'something wrong with this picture'. 'a state beyond the pale' has given me room to breathe. I cant thank you enough.. but thanks anyway. Robin,
you ruined my girlfriends plans for the weekend. bought the book at 4 on saturday and finished 7 on sunday. just another witless brit poisoned by the lies in our media and establishment, i have for years sat quietly, passively and cowardly consuming the fictions, exaggerations and outright lies designed to undermine Israel and by extension the jews - knowing there was ’something wrong with this picture’. ‘a state beyond the pale’ has given me room to breathe. I cant thank you enough..

but thanks anyway.

]]> By: Daubmir http://www.robinshepherdonline.com/review-of-my-new-book-a-state-beyond-the-pale-europes-problem-with-israel/#comment-2275 Daubmir Thu, 11 Mar 2010 09:57:43 +0000 http://www.robinshepherdonline.com/?p=1490#comment-2275 Sir, I would like to have your opinion and possibly your review of the recent book (a novel) by Assaf Gravron, "CrocAttack", just published by FourthEstate, and relating to suicide bombers in Israel. Your honest opinion, that is. Ibadti et haderekh sheli... Thank you Sir, I would like to have your opinion and possibly your review of the recent book (a novel) by Assaf Gravron, “CrocAttack”, just published by FourthEstate, and relating to suicide bombers in Israel.

Your honest opinion, that is.

Ibadti et haderekh sheli…

Thank you

]]> By: Kinkazzo http://www.robinshepherdonline.com/review-of-my-new-book-a-state-beyond-the-pale-europes-problem-with-israel/#comment-2237 Kinkazzo Mon, 08 Mar 2010 18:34:13 +0000 http://www.robinshepherdonline.com/?p=1490#comment-2237 Well, my friend, as promised I've read it and... I love you! Devoured it in two nights, I realised you wrote what I always wanted to write, but being Jewish myself, I thought I couldn't because I'd be biased, partial, unilateral, in fact "Zionist". Ha, ha, ha!!! You ain't Jewish, and you beautiful. Clear minded, well posited, good background, excellent discourse and truly factual, it's a much needed book and I hope it'll sell well - I'll spread the word, rest assured. We need all the friends we can get. Kol tuv, shalom K Well, my friend, as promised I’ve read it and… I love you!

Devoured it in two nights, I realised you wrote what I always wanted to write, but being Jewish myself, I thought I couldn’t because I’d be biased, partial, unilateral, in fact “Zionist”. Ha, ha, ha!!!

You ain’t Jewish, and you beautiful.
Clear minded, well posited, good background, excellent discourse and truly factual, it’s a much needed book and I hope it’ll sell well - I’ll spread the word, rest assured.

We need all the friends we can get.

Kol tuv, shalom

K

]]> By: iva http://www.robinshepherdonline.com/review-of-my-new-book-a-state-beyond-the-pale-europes-problem-with-israel/#comment-2136 iva Tue, 02 Mar 2010 18:10:22 +0000 http://www.robinshepherdonline.com/?p=1490#comment-2136 So I am to understand that my grand partents were gassed ,because they were khazars? I would defianatly buy you book as good reference when i battle with todays Anti Zionists meaning Anti -Israelism really meaning Antisemites So I am to understand that my grand partents were gassed ,because they were khazars?
I would defianatly buy you book as good reference when i battle with todays Anti Zionists meaning Anti -Israelism really meaning Antisemites

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